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Anna Bab's avatar

Yeah I'm not going to lie, watching Olandria, Andreina, and other beautiful women on LI experiencing rejection changed by brain chemistry in an oddly refreshing way.

When I've been friendzoned, I've often internalized the experience as proof that I'm not attractive enough. Like I just got denied entry to the pretty girl club. But Love Island has so many clear examples of this just not being the case all the time.

I've often read that even the most beautiful women on Earth will not be every person's cup of tea but always took it as major cope. Seeing it play out on screen is something else.

Also, I laughed out loud at the Taylor / Olandria comparison. A moment of silence for Olandria's beauty!

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Dean Moriarty's avatar

Wrote about this recently--for whatever reason, women have a very hard time taking responsibility for the condition of their relationships. I was mostly making this point about romantic relationships, but maybe it's true of others as well?

Like, men are WORSE at relationships in general, but guys who don't have friends, or who suck with women, or whatever, typically acknowledge that it's their fault. https://getbettersoon.substack.com/p/women-should-be-held-accountable

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lindsay's avatar

Idk, my takeaway from this article was that "good looks" definitely provides privilege, but does not shield from the sexism, the misogyny, the struggle, etc. the way society would have people believe it does. We live in an oppressive system that tries to enforce a strict standard for what is considered " handsome" or "beautiful" and considers anything that does not fit into that standard of attractiveness, to be less than or unworthy of love and happiness.

This is true for men and for women, because our society creates unrealistic expectations for both men and women. When in reality the "pretty privilege", even if achieved through exercise, dieting, surgery, etc. does not shield anyone (man or woman) from the everyday struggle, but it is a good way to keep people distracted, controlled, and consuming. And letting that absorb you, will keep you from exploring deeper parts of yourself, and defining your own worth outside of society's expectations.

While that may be what you were trying to say in your article, I think yours actually provided a pretty good example of society reinforcing someone's worth through their physical appearance, and their ability to achieve wealth and status. For both men and women.

The 'Women Should Be Held Accountable" article seems to be arguing that falling in line, losing weight, trying to fit the standard being forced upon us works, so women should also just fall in line, lose weight, give in to the idea that beauty and sex bring you love, happiness, and worth.

These are quotes from that article, and to me they actually describe how physical beauty is quite literally the most value a woman could provide. But then also outlines the unrealistic expectations of looks and wealth being forced onto men too.

- "Women offer men value through beauty, sex, care, affection, support, and kindness. If they cannot offer these things in sufficient measure to the value of the men they desire (men’s value = wealth, status, protection, looks, sex, care, affection, support and kindness), they are by definition too picky.

- "Let’s be honest, right now there are tons of women out there who would be far more successful finding a man if they did exactly what I did: lose weight, stop drinking so much. Or if they lowered their standards. Or if they learned to show men greater value by offering more sex, care, affection, support, and kindness—aka value. Or if they examined how they behave on dates to show more interest and be more seductive. Or whatever it is that’s causing them not be successful in entering into or maintaining healthy relationships."

I don't think it's specifically women's or men's fault. I think society forces a neat and narrow box on us, telling us what is pretty, what is handsome, what is considered successful, and tells us if you do not fit into that box, than you are less than. And that is hard to rise above when everything around you tries to reinforce that you must look a certain way, you must have this certain watch, this type of car, or have these types of muscles. Recognizing that everyone man or woman experiences that pressure, that most people do not fit into the box without bending and breaking, and not placing blame squarely on men or women is important. The blame is on our system, and we owe it to each other not to reinforce it. Even though it's really hard.

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ExerciseForLife's avatar

Why is everything due to society, for you? This is blank slate egalitarianism. Attraction is not a choice. No one “decided” that men being wealthy is attractive, it’s an innate biological drive deeply rooted in millions of years of evolution that pre-date even our species. Same thing applies to physical appearance. This ultimate theory for all of the ills of either gender needs to be thoroughly deleted already if we’re to make progress. You’ll never win vs. biological fact, ever.

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lindsay's avatar
4dEdited

lol oh man. The “attractiveness” you are describing is the dumb surface-level stuff and it literally changes with the trends. Of course people will be attracted to each other. The “attractiveness”, the gender roles and characteristics you seem to be referring to, and what’s captured in the linked article, is literally created and promoted on behalf of capitalism.

the “society” or the “system” I’m referring to means capitalism. we are conditioned via propaganda, from corporations + billionaires, to make us think we need to follow a certain path (take out a loan to go to college, get married young, buy a house in the suburbs, buy two cars, have lots of kids, etc), look a certain way, or have the most expensive things to be deserving of a nice life.

If you don’t end up on the “approved path”, wearing the right brands, then you did something wrong. Advertising and influencers are used to drill into our heads “what we like”. They literally tell us what we’re supposed to like.

Including what we are supposed to find “attractive”. And that’s bc telling us what we like makes it easier to mass produce stuff. All stuff. This surface level attractive stuff, the cars you have, the wealth, is literally just a distraction. It gives people something else to worry about, so we do not question the system oppressing us. (Capitalism)

TLDR:

society is capitalism. capitalism influences everything we are able to do. This includes influencing what people find “attractive”.

And capitalism is not rooted in millions of years of evolution.

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Emma's avatar

I am so glad you wrote about this and you’ve articulated it so well. And as an ugly woman, it’s all too easy to fall into the same trap of blaming all closed doors on my looks, just for the opposite reason. It’s not going to be 100% true in either case.

Also yeah very sick of hearing about the “dark side of pretty privilege”, lol!

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⋆⭒˚.⋆ grace ⋆⭒˚.⋆'s avatar

THIS IS SO FUCKING GOOD!!!!!!!!! i didn't watch love island but your point is so universally applicable to so many situations that i still completely understand and agree. i love this piece so so much.

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steph :)'s avatar

appreciate you and this comment 😭😭😭💘💘

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Amalie's avatar

Omg yes, I’m so tired of people inserting hotness into every conversation! Your hotness is the least interesting thing about you and there are so many other factors that determine chemistry and compatibility!

I also think it once again caters to a stereotype of women being too fragile. We don’t need to tiptoe so gently around the truth and center our reactions about rejection around hotness. It’s okay for someone to not have chemistry with you and it actually says verrrrrry little about you and your hotness. It’s okay for someone you want to be friends with to simply not vibe with you(again, it probably has nothing to do with your hotness levels).

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Jmk's avatar
4dEdited

Also beauty does not exist in a vacuum. The article touches on this, but I think it needs to be explored deeper. I think of a conventionally beautiful woman I used to work with. As I got to know her I stopped being able to see her beauty as she was not a kind or considerate person and constantly had conflict with people because of how she behaved. I have a different acquaintance who embodies some aspects of contention beauty (thin and blonde) however her opinion of her looks is very high and she attributes every interpersonal conflict with people being jealous or intimidated by her beauty. For years she gets let go from jobs, uninvited to parties and vacation trips, friendships end abruptly etc and she has zero self awareness that it’s her personality and how she treats people that is the issue not her appearance.

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catherine emmanuella's avatar

i’ll leave this here

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Giampiero Campa's avatar

Good looking? Yes. Extremely hot body? Yes. But “exceptionally beautiful” ? Not necessarily. IMHO, not exceptionally beautiful the way, say, Halle Berry could be, just to name one. Not sure about her face (maybe a slight bit masculine perhaps?) if I have to be completely honest. Above a certain level, say the difference between an 8 and a 10, becomes totally a matter of personal preference. Also above that level things like emotional connection (or at the very minimum not be annoying) become more important. Not sure about his options since I don’t watch the show, but people also get tired and/or need to explore. Other than that I agree 100% that the narrative that beauty is the only thing that matters makes a ton of damages.

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Nia's avatar

This is such a weird comment btw!

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Kryptogal (Kate, if you like)'s avatar

Well, the author DID specifically ask readers to let her know if they disagreed that Oliandra was way hotter than Taylor...

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Anna Bab's avatar

I’m not even sure if they disagreed in their comment.

They’re saying that there might’ve been other exceptionally beautiful women on the show, in which case personal preferences start to become more of a deciding factor.

This is actually true on Love Island. Most of the women there are beautiful. The woman who Taylor eventually couples up with, seems more like his physical type than Olandria.

Same thing with Pepe and Iris, Andreina, Gracyn.

In my neck of the woods Andreina would be the most conventionally attractive person. Pepe still friendzoned her for Gracyn and Iris (he has a type).

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Kryptogal (Kate, if you like)'s avatar

Yep, people have types. I actually think Taylor is quite cute, so I'm surprised he's considered so far "beneath" Oliandra. But I guess I like his cowboy style.

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Chuck Connor's avatar

Coming from a town where the biggest even locally is the rodeo, this guy just doesn’t seem cowboy to me at all lol. I think of either a short king white dude or an even shorter Mexican guy lol

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Kryptogal (Kate, if you like)'s avatar

Yeah it's fake cowboy, for sure, but I still like it, he looks laid back and Oliandra does not. Also, real cowboys are rather terrifying, they're getting tossed off large angry animals starting at about age 6 😂

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azzy's avatar

Truly such an odd system they have. I think the rating system is the refuge of the socially inept.

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Steve's avatar

I agree that to go from an 8 to a 10 is the most subjective zone. I’m a huge fan of the oval face and triangle smile. I feel a rush like drugs when I meet a woman like this in the wild. But a lot of guys would not place them in the hottest of hot category but I’m fine with that. More for me. haha

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with love, from molly <3's avatar

This is such an important conversation! Especially re the “other women don’t want to be friends with me because I’m pretty” narrative. Too many women are walking around in this world thinking people hate them because they’re pretty when the truth is, people hate them because they’re bad people. I once had a girl come up to me at a party and tell me that she’s so glad I invited her because, and I quote, “normally girls with boyfriends hate me because I’m pretty….” Needless to say, she proceeded to try and hook up with my boyfriend…. Like it is genuinely concerning how many girls think their beauty is the issue, and not their lack of compassion and ethics. Being pretty doesn’t automatically mean you’re a good person, and constantly putting the blame on your beauty will prevent you from ever being able to truly take a look at yourself and take accountability for your moral shortcomings.

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Chris Jesu Lee's avatar

"I once had a girl come up to me at a party and tell me that she’s so glad I invited her because, and I quote, “normally girls with boyfriends hate me because I’m pretty….” Needless to say, she proceeded to try and hook up with my boyfriend…."

Comedy

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jazhands's avatar

Exactly. To me, it's just as silly as someone saying they're disliked because other people are jealous. No, it's likely you're not a pleasant person to be around, and you just never bothered to critically examine why people keep having similar reactions to your presence. Tolstoy said something about how foolish it is that we suppose beauty is goodness, and it's so true! We assume beautiful people are good until proven otherwise.

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with love, from molly <3's avatar

Also just to clarify, I broke up with the boyfriend hahahaa - don’t worry, this isn’t me blaming her entirely for that, they were both shitty

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kath's avatar
6dEdited

as i've gotten older, i come to see how absurd the obsession with beauty truly is. not to mention the fact that, if we're lucky, we'll eventually age out of it. when your desirability gets taken off the table, how then will you view yourself and the world? it's better to start shifting your focus now than to and realize decades later it was never that serious to begin with.

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Lasagna's avatar

Aren’t all the women on the show beautiful? Or is it more interesting than that? And if they’re all beautiful isn’t it a guarantee that some of them will “lose” (it’s a contest, right?)

Good article. I have no idea if this is the kind of humor you’d like - it’s definitely from a prior age - but this topic reminded me of an old SomethingAwful article I read. I can’t believe I was able to find it (it’s like 20years old) so I figure I’m cosmically supposed to link to it: https://www.somethingawful.com/guides/guide-college-cutie/1/.

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LOAM's avatar

I love how you broke it down. You’ve named an experience I’ve managed to navigate through self mastery. understanding that the language we use to describe experiences is very important to our critical thinking because then we grow instead of repeating mistakes and using scapegoat terms that don’t hold our part accountable.

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Charles McBryde's avatar

this was really good, thank you!

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sarah's avatar

I have not been a fan of Taylor but I felt it was so obvious from the very beginning, literally day one, that he was simply not that into her. They could say they’re “slow burning” all they wanted but it was right there for everyone to see. He wasn’t interested in her physically. I was not at all shocked that he chose Clarke. I also did not understand the outrage and confusion over his choice. The entire premise of the show is to explore. It’s an extremely simple situation to understand. He met someone he connected with better? It happens daily in the real world. Could he have been more clear? Could he have handled it better? Sure, sure, sure. But for people to truly look at the situation and think how could he NOT be into Olandria because look at her and look at him… He didn’t like her!!!! He just didn’t. Why is that hard to grasp for so many woman I wonder. It doesn’t take away from who she is or how beautiful she is. She’s still fully whole and wonderful without his validation. But she wasn’t for him… very, very strange to see how this situation was received by viewers.

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Meagan Rochard's avatar

fabulous as always, steph! thank you for writing this!

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Barnaby's avatar

Absolutely! And the culture of pitting girls against girls that it reiterates!

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Jason Chastain's avatar

😂 it’s true, women lie to themselves and to each other all the time.

And if they aren’t very good at receiving criticism (who is?), just watch how women come to her defense if the critic is a man. Zero thought will go to whether the criticism is accurate. Instead the critic will instantly be called a “misogynist“ or “Incel”, etc.

and frankly in this case a very famous line comes to mind:

“Show me the world‘s most beautiful woman, and I’ll show you a man who’s tired of sleeping with her.”

Being pretty doesn’t mean they’re pleasant to be around. And sometimes they’re enough of a hassle to get dumped rapidly. I think that’s probably why actors like Leo DiCaprio just find rather unknown models to date instead of a famous actress. He doesn’t want a Primadonna or a clash of egos. He just wants a beautiful woman on his arm who can join his program for a time.

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Merab's avatar

Thank heavens men are great at accepting criticism and rejection.

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Jason Chastain's avatar

😂 We all suck at it, but men are more conditioned to hearing brutal truths and self reflecting to make improvements. If a guy is a simp or a wuss and a woman calls him out, for example, you won’t see other men saying “you go, king. She doesn’t deserve you. You’re a Giga-Chad who deserves better. She’s just got big Vag energy. Total Misandrist and FemCel.”

😂😂😂 It’s funny just writing that delusional crap.

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Merab's avatar

I agree. Men are so hardwired to hear brutal truths and are progressively improving their lives. It's these delusional women that are out killing poor men for rejecting them and have their group of minions support their actions.

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azzy's avatar

He’s not going to get this

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Cinema Timshel's avatar

Unfortunately, in contexts that involve unchecked feminine relational aggression and men with sufficient depressive tendencies your second sentence here is not in fact so far from the truth. See for instance the comics artist Ed Piskor.

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Georgette Boggio's avatar

If it comes from other men . . . .

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jazhands's avatar

No, men just start entire movements demonising and degrading women, and eventually even maybe killing them? See Elliott Rodgers etc. The way men build each other up after rejection is evident in the incel movement, and that does not involve healthy coping mechanisms, it involves blaming women and even potentially plotting how to hurt/kill them.

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Jason Chastain's avatar

Didn’t know who that was. Had to look him up. What can I say? Serial killers have historically targeted promiscuous women for whatever reasons.

But bad women being in the target of the mentally deranged has nothing to do with the topic of delusional women or women who make bad choices because they weren’t taught me better. Unrelated.

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jazhands's avatar

oh no sir, if that's what you took away from the Elliot Rodger shooting, we are done. Your poor mother, you need to apologise to her xxx

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Jason Chastain's avatar

Oh really? A nutburger who wounded and killed 20 people 11 years ago. There’s lots of killers who target women. Ever heard of Jack the Ripper? Clearly you are making too much of it. 🙄

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Jen's avatar

Looool! Totally.

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jabster's avatar

Great article. Gen Z keeps proving to this Gen X dad that we're all going to be OK.

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